this post was submitted on 24 Oct 2024
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Privacy

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Okay the title is a bit exaggerated, but honestly not far off. This post is very mundane and a bit long, but thought it fits the community.

I'm visiting my home country and went shopping for pants, there were "30% off everything!" signs with a tiny text underneath that said "member discount" (don't have membership). Not a problem, did not notice and I don't care for such marketing tricks to get you into the store but okay.

Picked up couple of pants, went to the cashier and they asked me "do you have our membership?" - I answered no and expected the follow up question whether I'd like to join, but, to my positive surprise the cashier just happily responded "okay, not a problem!" and continued to bag my stuff.

I stood ready to pay and then the cashier said "now I just need your phone number and you can pay". Hold up. What. I did not expect that, I honestly had a burst of anger inside me (never gonna take it on a cashier, they are just doing their job). I asked nicely why do I need to give my phone number and I was told that to register me as a member so I can get the discount.

I declined and said I don't want to join and would like to just pay.

The entire interaction after questioning why they need my phone number was awkward, as if I had been the first person to decline, the weirdo, aluminum foil hat wearing hermit.

This was just one of many interactions in the recent years that make me feel as if I was a weirdo for not sharing all my info around. The worst is when everyone keeps telling me "its just an app, just download it and use that why do you make things complicated" or "just sign up you don't need to pay anything".

Thank you for reading my mundane rant, would you like to hear more? Just sign up for my weekly mailing list! ~~Your email will be shared with our 12 453 partners~~

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Nah, you're not abnormal. I've had the same thing happen at multiple store. The most invasive has been Microcenter; they tell me that I have to give them my email in order to wait in line for tech support, and then bombard me with spam. Every time I buy something new there, I have to tell the cashier to NOT use the address on file that they won't unlink from my bank card.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Microcenter hasn’t been nearly the worst of it for me, but I can confirm the spam side of it. I had to give them my email for some part warranties. However the actual emails in my case was just a single click to unsubscribe or change the preferences (It’s been a while, don’t remember which) and it was done just like that. It’s still a little infuriating that I have to give them my email though, let alone the spam that comes along side it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 days ago

Yeah, but every time I have to buy something new, they automatically sign me up again. They never give me an opt-out.

[–] [email protected] 84 points 5 days ago (17 children)

(Your Area Code) 867-5309. None of the younger store clerks know the song reference when I give them this number. But I get chuckles from older folks in line behind me

[–] [email protected] 31 points 5 days ago (1 children)

There's usually already an account with that number, so just try it out. You probably don't even need to actually open an account. BTW, if you do open an account, don't expect that a fake phone number is going to keep you anonymous. Everything is linked these days. All of the big data brokers are buying and selling information to each other. The second you swipe a card, it's going to match that card to real information from some random online purchase 95 years ago, and they'll have all of your real information, including political preferences, address, phone number, all of your email addresses, ethnicity, height, weight, sexual preferences, everything. They have it all, and it's all linked to every credit card you have ever used.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 days ago (1 children)

No point asking them to justify why they have to ask, they probably don't even know. Just say "Sorry, I don't give that out". I've never had a store push back after that - they probably get it all the time.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 days ago

Why not lie ? My phone number is 526-432-8267

[–] [email protected] 33 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Every time this happens to me, the clerk/cashier just shrugs and is like, "okay". They get it, but are obligated to try anyway. The best you can do is be polite.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 days ago

100% would never want to make their day tougher than it already probably is.

This hermit politely declined, paid, thanked, and left. The anger I felt was towards the retail company and the clerk doesn't need to witness that.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 4 days ago

I'm a casher in the US of fuckin A and I can assure you that we don't care on a personal level what you do. If someone not having or wanting to enter a phone number at the register is the weirdest customer thing that happens in a shift then it's the most relaxed shift of my damn life.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 4 days ago (1 children)

This is sadly very common where I'm from, except you don't even get a discount from it. I've taken to just politely declining, since I'm sure the person working the cash is probably pressured to get people to give their personal info.

"And can get your email?"

"No thank you"

"I need your email for the receipt"

"I appreciate it but no thank you"

It's a slight non sequitur while still being polite. Saying "no thank you" when someone is pressuring you works well in many situations.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 days ago (1 children)

The receipt is rarely optional for the store though, if you ask for a print out they would have to do it

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 days ago (1 children)

The email is 100% optional though. Also customer can decline a receipt.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 days ago (2 children)

Right, they can't refuse issuing a ticket because you don't want to provide an email.

In some countries receiving the ticket is not optional even for the customer 😭

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 5 days ago (2 children)

Everyone's approaching this from the privacy aspect, but the real reason isn't that the cashier thought you were weird, they're just underpaid and under a lot of pressure from management to try multiple times and in some cases they even get written up for not doing it because it's deemed part of their job. They hate it just as much as you. Same when you try to cancel your cable subscription or whatever: the calls are recorded and their performance is monitored and they make damn sure they try at least 3 times to upsell you, even when it's painfully obvious you're done with them.

Just politely decline until they asked however many times they're required to ask and move on.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

... they're just underpaid and under a lot of pressure from management to try multiple times and in some cases they even get written up for not doing it because it's deemed part of their job. They hate it just as much as you.

I've worked retail and call centre jobs and I can assure you this is many people (at least those who are not too exhausted to care). These workers are constantly pressured to enshitify their service at the expense of theirs and the customer's experience.

I haven't worked a counter in over a decade, so can only imagine it's got worse.

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[–] [email protected] 46 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I had this experience once in an Ikea, of all places. I calmly told the clerk that according to local laws (which I cited), it was illegal for them to demand that information from me (phone number and post code) to sell me anything, and if the computer wouldn’t let them do it, then they should call a manager for an override.

When the manager came, the clerk said “this person refuses to give me their info” — to which I added, “your computer refuses to comply with the law; please override and then notify HQ that they are in contravention of the law and liable for significant fines.”

The next time I went in, they still asked me for the info, but the clerk was able to override. I suspect they just put in fake info for everyone who refused to supply it.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Well done for taking a stand. The problem, as ever, is that most people prefer to comply obediently even if it feels wrong. And then next thing we know, it becomes standard practice.

BTW I have been in your situation and responded similarly. Usually it ends in the clerk inputting dummy info, sometimes after I irritably tell them to do so.

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 5 days ago (3 children)

Stores will never respect your privacy or data, so you have no obligation to respect a corporation’s expectation of truth.

Just have memorized fake data ready for bullshit like this, say it when asked. Then the retail person who cares even less than you about it (but is forced to pretend they do, in order to survive) can get to their break faster. Win win

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 days ago (1 children)

I wonder where you live that that happened. In America you're expected to say no, cashiers don't care. They don't get paid enough to.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 days ago

This happened in Finland, but I didn't want to specify it to spark a universal conversation, which succeeded!

I know people from all around the globe deal with privacy issues and hoped that others would share their experiences.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 5 days ago (4 children)

Maybe just an awkward sales agent, or they thought you were mad at them for in their mind trying to help. I decline phone number and zip code all the time. Also been using someone else's phone number at grocery stores for years -- started by mistake. I don't care about accumulated points or whatever but discounts at grocery store are pretty significant for me.

But I understand your frustration in general. Keep up the good fight :)

[–] [email protected] 15 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Any time a store asks for a phone number, I use the local area code followed by 867-5309, and 9/10 times it works

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 5 days ago

What's frustrating is that they're not real discounts. The Club Price is the regular price, and you have to agree to tracking in order to not pay above retail.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (1 children)

I do this all the time.

"Can I have your address?"

"For a haircut? No, will it let you skip it? Ok good do that then, thanks. I don't need 50 new mailers a month about damn haircuts, you feel me."

Problem solved.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 days ago

“I don’t have one” is what I typically say lol

[–] [email protected] 23 points 5 days ago (2 children)

"Would you like to donate money to us that we pretty pretty promise will go to some vague charity while we reap the tax benefits? No? Are you sure? Fine, we'll just ask you next time (regardless of your answer this time)."

[–] [email protected] 11 points 5 days ago (1 children)

What tax benefits? Sure they can deduct the donation, but that just cancels out the income from you giving them the money to donate. It's net zero for the company.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 days ago (1 children)

I hear the charity tax myth all the time and I don't understand why everyone just believes it.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Obviously, it's not possible for a store to claim a tax deduction for a customer's charity donation. But, the store can claim tax deductions for the cost of collecting the donated money on the charities behalf.

Costs would include: a percentage of the staff members salary for asking the customer to donate, equipment costs to modify the registers to process donations, a percentage of the credit card transaction fees, a percentage of the shop lease costs, etc etc.

Initially, it sounds ridiculous as the real costs of what I listed above would realistically land somewhere between zero and shit-all. But we can be sure that the businesses that ask their customers for charity donations have all the numbers geared heavily in their favor.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 days ago

Except all of those things you listed would be business expenses which aren't taxable as they would be deducted from gross profits as part of the calculation for determining net profit (which is the taxable part of profit) and if they're also using that as a charitable contribution then they are deducting it twice which the IRS tends to frown upon. Or at least they would if they had any kind of worthwhile enforcement mechanism for dealing with corporations.

I would assume the tax agencies of countries outside the US similarly frown upon such double deductions, possibly even with effective enforcement.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 days ago (4 children)

Why don't you just lie ... Each time a different name surname email address physical address phone number ... Yeah sometimes it's Mandatory to use a real address for delivery purposes just put a random name in and add a post-it on the doorbell saing something on the line of leave packages for Crudelia demon here please. Temp mail for most discounts is enough... The test cases in which they do not only ask for your phone but also want to verify it it's pretty slim ...

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Some email services will let you append arbitrary strings to the end of your email address with a +. Whenever a sales associate asks for my email to sign up for discounts, I give them [email protected]. I love the looks I get for that.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 days ago (2 children)

That's the advice I've gotten here pretty much, and will probably deal with it in that way from now on!

It is sad that we have to do that, but don't think this will change any time soon.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (2 children)

I have a second SIM that I use for situations where I don't want to give out my real number.

It's a traditional PAYG SIM where I pay for a tiny bit of credit and it lasts until I use it. I need to make a billable once every few months to keep it active. So I just text myself once every couple of months. The $10 I put on it will last a few years before I need to top it up. Or I could just 'burn' it and get a new one.

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I was looking at ISPs yesterday as my current contract ran out so they're taking the opportunity to wring me for all my money. One place I looked at has a regular price and "members price" for every plan. I go to see what a membership entails and it points me to download an app. No clue if the membership is free or not because I don't want or need an app for every utility and purchase I make. People like you and I are not the norm but from my viewpoint you're being reasonable and the world has lost all sense of normalcy and reason.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 5 days ago (3 children)

From a privacy point of view, it makes pefect sense to not share your phone number with a merchant. The only buisness you have with them is a single transaction, they don't need any more information about you other than knowing that you paid.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 5 days ago (1 children)

When I worked retail, I never asked for phone or address or anything. If they volunteered it, I’d do it, but I never asked. Management talked to me about it several times and I just kept not doing it. I think they kept me on in busy times because I could blast through any line of customers faster than anyone else (I wonder why 🤔)

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

I think your misinterpreting your own social anxieties as being made to feel like an "outcast".

The fact of the matter is it's just not normal to question why a store wants your phone number and I'm sure the cashier was taken aback by the whole situation.

Convenience, not privacy, is the norm. There is going to be tons and tons of awkward social interactions when you go against social norms. Accept it and be proud your advocating for your privacy.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 5 days ago (3 children)

I stood ready to pay and then the cashier said "now I just need your phone number and you can pay". Hold up. What. I did not expect that, I honestly had a burst of anger inside me (never gonna take it on a cashier, they are just doing their job). I asked nicely why do I need to give my phone number and I was told that to register me as a member so I can get the discount.

"Sure thing, It's +XX 111 222 3333" Just give them garbage.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 5 days ago

The last time I bought a Mac was like 10 years ago, at an independent computer shop that specialized in them. The person at the register insisted on getting my personal info "because Apple needed it" but I didn't want to give it. The person at the register very slowly sauntered up to their manager, had a long discussion, and eventually they figured something out because I suddenly didn't need to give my info. It was kind of nervewracking because I was paying cash and I was like: what if I hand it over, and they change their mind? It's not like I could call the cops, I'm the wrong demographic.

Anyway, whenever I thought about getting an Apple system, I remembered that experience and went with something else.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 days ago

Caring for your Privacy and the general privacy of society in the aggregate, given the increasing data mining, collecting, advertising and other trends is the normal mindset.

Getting propagandised and brainwashed into thinking that paying, with your own money for literal microphoned devices operated by for-profit-focused Corps that will listen in and record you so as to give you lazy weather updates or help you play a song, or purchase knick-knacks online in exchanhe is the crazy take.

Getting you to feel ackward is the point of peer-pressure and their Marketing. Just ignore it. You are not in the wrong.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 days ago

I don't have a phone or address, I am unhoused.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 5 days ago (3 children)

Another way they get your phone number is mandatory SMS 2FA login. The Dunkin Donuts app does this shitty behavior.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 5 days ago

I miss print coupons. Hearing "get the app" or "there's an app for it" makes me flinch these days.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I asked nicely why do I need to give my phone number and I was told that to register me as a member so I can get the discount.

I declined and said I don’t want to join and would like to just pay.

I've just said "I don't have one" when asked this for awhile. This never seems the phase the cashiers, I'm guessing they know what that really means. Half the time I still get whatever discount, though I've never tried to sign up for a membership saying that.

If it's an online form my phone number is just (local area code)555–5555. I've never had that not take, except for one case where it automatically enabled 2-factor auth and I had to create a new account.

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