Technology

Yeah, self hosting isn't for most lay people if it's just a GitHub repo...

If ecobee put their backend code on GitHub, I bet it would be self hostable with docker within a week.

Newer versions are Homekit compatible and can be controlled over the local network.

It is also nice that these just degrade to regular thermostats. It isn't like they are completely stopping working. It would be nice if you could swap out the API, or they keep the API running longer (how much work can maintaining it be?). But this sounds like a pretty graceful degradation.

It would be nice to have these speak some common Zigbee protocol or similar. But this isn't the worst behaviour I have seen from companies.

The newer Ecobee's can run entirely locally through their homekit integration. I tie mine into home assistant and use it that way. I would never have bought the device if that wasn't available.

If this old version doesn't have that available then I'm assuming people purchased it knowing that it was reliant on cloud services. It would be nice if they offered customers options besides just letting the device turn into e-waste but you can understand why they don't want to burn development hours on a device that's a decade and a half old.

Just another reason to never buy devices that can't function without a cloud service.

I don't understand the mindset of people who buy these things in the first place. Occasionally there's an article like, "guy's entire house suddenly inoperable after Amazon ban," people just don't think that will happen to them? It is local control on a standardized protocol or nothing for me.

Probably because this came out 16 years ago, before HomeAssistant even existed, it will still maintain wifi support for checking and controlling with your phone even after they cut off the cloud connection, and all their new products do have a local API and can still be used with HomeAssistant or whatever other local home automation server you have.

Yeah. The server and software should be open source and API available. That way we actually own the system and don't have to just toss it out if someone goes out of business.

Fucking ulock for example suddenly wants me to create an account and sign in to their website to use my front door lock! What the fuck is that! We need consumer protections for this sort of shit. I didn't sign up to giving away when I come in and when I go out of my house! WTF to the max!

For a thermostat that's built into a house, 16 years doesn't seem long enough, tbh. A 'dumb' thermostat can easily be in use for 30+ years before anyone would even consider replacing it.

But yeah, as you said, if it's connected to the internet you have to worry about software patches, certificates, etc.

16 years old? That thermostat has sure had a run

I have game consoles that are more than twice that old and still play reliably. Apple really skewed our idea of lifespans for electronics, didn't they? It's a thermostat, they should be designed to install and forget for the next half-century. It's a core part of a house, like the plumbing and breaker box.

While I very strongly agree with your message, I have to say that this is one of the least fitting usernames I've ever seen.

That truly depends on how secure Ecobee made it… I’ve seen some smart devices that use SSL (https) for all communication and do some sort of certificate authentication, making it virtually impossible to decrypt its communication protocol without a valid private key…

Having said that, it’d be nice if Ecobee took the initiative and opened up these older devices, if they could do so without comprising the security of all their others.

I disagree - definitely not OK by me, though likely legal. People bought this because they wanted and paid extra for an internet connected device, and a regular thermostat is not that. I mean, would you be OK if your TV manufacturer disabled the screen and streamed radio stations instead?

If you bought one of these because you have a heat pump and want to consider the outside temp, that service is now cut off. Not ideal.

Every one of my IT colleagues over about 35 is an absolute luddite. No IoT, no smart appliances, and a hardened firewall for everything that needs access. Location tracking and biometrics disabled on our phones, no cloud services, etc.

The appeal is remote and centralized management, easier programming and more features. If that’s not worth it to you to replace your thermostat every 16 years, then nobody is forcing you to get one.

But being able to change the temp from my phone from anywhere is worth it to me, as well as including it with other automations for all my connected devices. The appeal is honestly not hard to see, even if it’s not worth it for you personally.

It’s a thermostat.

I’m coming from a field where supporting software written in the 70s is the norm.

Your argument is horribly short-sighted and wasteful.

Only 16 years old is extremely recent software that ought to be easily maintained in any sane world.

I'm in my house right now with a perfectly working thermostat that's 70 years old.

And given the mechanism of action it will continue working in another 70 years.

16 years for hardware used inside of homes is a ridiculously, absurdly, short lifetime. Even for a vehicle that would be pushing the edge of "too short".

That said 16-year-old software is not that old. If it's built using sane language choices it should actually be functioning and modern today.

and 16 years is a hell of a lifetime

Think about it like this: Even if the average home nowadays had only about 10 such devices (I am quite sure the average home has a lot more), that are needed for kitchen appliances, heating, warm water, window shutters, solar panels, etc to function - that means on average about once a year one of the essential functions in the house stops working unless you replace a part. Not because it's broken, but because "SW support is discontinued". Seriously, I want to smash everyones faces for those "early adopters" who think smart homes are great, and of course the companies who put software in every little component.

That is a horrible argument.

Just get a non shit induction stove

My mom has an induction stove that has knobs.

Definitely a thing, Miele even has a device filter for that feature.

It's just on and then hold b for boost now. It automatically detects which slot you have placed your pan on and selects that for you. But I get your point...

Induction is great 👍

Long clicking on [3] then + + + + + + to boil your f eggs?

A lot of them have a terrible UI. But that's far from all of them. Enough have sliders. Sometimes one with a pan detection. Sometimes a slider per area.