this post was submitted on 13 Jan 2025
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[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Revolution requires convincing 8 billion people of a possible utopia whereas market socialism exists right now to some degree - FOSS, cooperatives, credit unions etc. are all part of market socialism. 120 million Americans for example are part of credit unions - more than any big bank in America. If we connected all the credit unions so they could talk to each other, you could transact with any branch or ATM - it could rival any big bank. It is harder to convince someone to upend their life for revolution than to convince them the benefits of credit unions over regular banking (again, markets, or in this case banking exists, and we need to engage with it currently). As for donating, many donate to Wikipedia, fediverse etc. When we are not starving, we'll donate it all to a good cause.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

First off, it's great that you're thinking about things seriously, I don't want to discredit that effort. However, there are several issues with this.

  1. Revolution

Historically, revolution has happened in the Global South, and not merely by convincing the working class, but through organization. Look to how Russia, China, Cuba, Vietnam, etc all had revolutions, and you'll see it was driven by sharpening contradictions in class antagonisms.

  1. "Utopia"

Marxism rejects Utopianism, ie thinking of a model and trying to build it outright. Marxism requires revolution, yes, but takes a gradualist approach to collectivization once the revolution has happened. This is Scientific Socialism, which analyzes trajectories in Capitalism to predict what a Socialist society would look like.

  1. FOSS

FOSS isn't "Market Socialism." It's its own category of software that doesn't rely on profit or competition.

  1. Connecting all of the Credit Unions

How do you plan to go about such a monumental task? Most Credit Unions are local organizations, for local users. There isn't a historical example of this happening.

  1. Going from a unified Credit Union to charity

Under Capitalism, even with a unified Credit Union, people still suffer from being at the whims of wealthy Capitalists, and likely wouldn't be willing to or able to donate en mass.

For all of these reasons, this isn't really a practical plan, which is why studying history and theory is important.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago) (1 children)

Under Capitalism, even with a unified Credit Union, people still suffer from being at the whims of wealthy Capitalists, and likely wouldn’t be willing to or able to donate en mass.

If you can imagine a global unified credit union, where everyone is equal, with better benefits than traditional banks, you've essentially removed capitalists from banking - think about that. You could do the same with other essential industries like education, healthcare, food etc.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 hours ago

I understand the concept, the problem is with implementing it from where we are now, and proving that energy would not be better applied via revolution and implementing Socalism. Your thought process is along the same lines as the Utopian Socialists like Owen, who tried to convince people but ultimatley failed. The reason Marxism has a much better track record is because of Scientific Socialism, which is based on analyzing how to get from here to there. I recommend reading Socialism: Utopian and Scientific.