I love that you think that you are right and that it the people that disagree with you who should change their mind. Have you ever considered that maybe u might need to change ur beliefs as well?
this post was submitted on 31 Mar 2025
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Hah, no. When I look at the conservative party all I see is hate, hate and more hate.
You hate the people that are different from you or whoever you're told to hate. You spend so much time dressing up this hate to make it more palatable for yourself and others, but if you peel it all away, that's what really drives you and your fellow conservatives and it is just shameful.
At least with the tankies, what they do, they do because it'll bring true equality (or at least that's what they're led to believe).
The reign pullers for conservatives tells you to vote for them, support them, spread propaganda for them to hate on a group because some group deserves your hate for one inane reason or another.
The reign pullers for tankies have to get their support by promising good things like equality, the banishment of the rich, full unalienable human rights to include healthcare.
Yea the reign pullers are lying, they always do that on all sides, but what they have to lie to you about to get you to do the things they want you to do MATTERS.
And the lies they feed you, are disgusting.
Hah, no. When I look at the conservative party all I see is hate, hate and more hate.
American political parties do not define political perspective globally. U can have conservative views and still hate what the us conservative party is doing.
You hate the people that are different from you or whoever you're told to hate. You spend so much time dressing up this hate to make it more palatable for yourself and others, but if you peel it all away, that's what really drives you and your fellow conservatives and it is just shameful.
Not at all I hate people who oppose freedom and equal ity of opportunity. Turns out thats both parties when it comes to the us.
At least with the tankies, what they do, they do because it'll bring true equality (or at least that's what they're led to believe).
That's the same thing as what Hitler promised. The ends do not justify the means.
The reign pullers for conservatives tells you to vote for them, support them, spread propaganda for them to hate on a group because some group deserves your hate for one inane reason or another.
The left says the exact same thing for the exact same reasons just they point the hate at different groups of people.
The reign pullers for tankies have to get their support by promising good things like equality, the banishment of the rich, full unalienable human rights to include healthcare.
Equality of opportunity or equality of outcome cos those are 2 very different things. I would argue that's its a human right to do with your own body as u choose. Its the same right that gives women the right to an abortion that also gives Nazis the right to spew their hate and wave their arms around as they please. You cannot have one without the other.
I'm in Australia where we have free healthcare and I think that it should be a free for all. In fact I'm fighting against the right wingers of my country who are trying to make our system more like your fucked up system.
Yea the reign pullers are lying, they always do that on all sides, but what they have to lie to you about to get you to do the things they want you to do MATTERS.
So why align with any political group if u know they are all the same playing the same games. Pick beliefs u believe in personaly from all sides of political ideology. Tribalism for any side is just as bad as tribalism for any other side do not try justify ur team to urself simply because they are your team.
And the lies they feed you, are disgusting.
I never said I believe the lies I'm simply saying that the side u hate because you where told to hate have some good points. This doesn't mean I subscribe to all their beliefs nor do I subscriber to all the left wing beliefs.
We all have far more in common than things we don't. I would encourage you to think/enquire why people u disagree with hold the beliefs they do with an open mind and you might just find u agree.
Hah, don't try to play the reasonable middle-ground card with me.
American political parties do not define political perspective globally. U can have conservative views and still hate what the us conservative party is doing.
Sure, hide behind semantics. I'm clearly talking about conservatism as an ideology - the same ideology that opposes progress and protects hierarchies of power worldwide. Whether it's the US Republican party, the UK Tories, or Australia's Liberal party - it's all built on the same foundations of preserving privilege for some at the expense of others.
Not at all I hate people who oppose freedom and equality of opportunity.
Bull. The policies your "side" keeps pushing TARGET specific groups of people - immigrants, LGBTQ+ folks, Black and brown communities. Don't pretend it's about some noble principle when the outcomes keep hurting the same people over and over.
That's the same thing as what Hitler promised.
Are you seriously comparing leftist policies to Nazism? This is peak bad-faith argument. Hitler used promises of "equality" as a very thin veneer to scapegoat Jews and other minorities. Hitler's "equality" was only (and openly) for his defined "master race" - it was exclusionary by design. Leftist policies aim to include everyone in their benefits. In some cases the same tactics the right uses today, Hitler was far closer to today's right-wingers than left
The left says the exact same thing for the exact same reasons just they point the hate at different groups of people.
No, we don't. Being intolerant of intolerance isn't the same as hating someone for their identity. Calling out bigotry isn't "hate" - it's accountability. I refuse to accept this false equivalence.
Equality of opportunity or equality of outcome cos those are 2 very different things.
This talking point is so tired. There IS no "equality of opportunity" when systemic barriers exist from birth. Your side loves to pretend we're all starting on equal footing when that's demonstrably false.
I'm in Australia where we have free healthcare
Oh, so you enjoy the benefits of "leftist" policies while arguing against them? How convenient. And yes, your healthcare system IS better than our nightmare - because it operates on COLLECTIVE responsibility rather than individual "freedom."
So why align with any political group if u know they are all the same playing the same games.
They're not all the same, and that was my entire point about. What they lie ABOUT matters.
When progressive leaders lie, they're promising universal healthcare, living wages, and equal rights they might not be able to deliver. When conservative leaders lie, they're just literally scapegoating immigrants, LGBTQ+ people, and minorities for all of society's problems.
I align with the side that at least has to PRETEND to care about making everyone's lives better, not the side that openly campaigns on making certain people's lives worse. The fact that you can't see this difference proves you're not the "free thinker" you claim to be.
Both sides have corruption and liars, but only one side has to appeal to basic human decency to get votes. That's why it matters who supports whom, even knowing politicians will more likely than not disappoint me.
I never said I believe the lies
Yet here you are, repeating every conservative talking point in the book. You claim to be above it all while pushing the exact rhetoric that maintains the status quo.
Save your "both sides" nonsense for someone who'll fall for it. I'm not interested.
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What if they convert you into right wing ideology?
I've watched conservative theists unravel and admit things about themselves openly as they crash out under questioning they started by making a thread on debate forums, but they always relapsed by the next day.
If it means anything, I started my journey on lemmy as an armchair socialist who in practice was more a welfare capitalism type person. Now I’m a full on anarchist (anti-capitalist). So a steady stream of influence, especially when people make good points and it helps make sense of my suffering, has shifted my political views strongly.
(But the basis for that shift was already kind of laid out, I’ve been fascinated by anarchist critiques for a while, and one of my favourite political authors was one. But the sort of being in a community of likeminded people [lemmy] and having significant suffering at the hands of the current system that made me more strongly shift towards those views).
On the other hand. Simply having a few conversations with my vaguely left wing partner about my views has led her to go from vaguely social democrat to anarchist.
I think the lesson is change is possible, it’s just a slow series of events that add up. Usually there isn’t one thing that straight up switches a person.
That's super unique because most people that are anarchists are anarcho-capitalists and that's generally what people mean by ancap.
Anarchy sort of implies Capitalism.
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I'm conservative, but I've never seen it happen in either direction. Internet arguments are more about the audience than the tankie you're arguing against.
To be fair, it's kinda unusual to all of a sudden be convinced that it's ok to be racist, like exploitation, and be against helping the unfortunate.
I know right? Especially when the other guy is convinced he's not being racist and he's helping the unfortunate, like most lefties.
I disagree with you.
However I would like the full version of that argument. Please.
I don't this will lead anywhere productive, but alright, first let's get our terms straight. Racism is prejudice based on race or discrimination based on that prejudice. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/racism
Right now, there's this out-group bias. I'm not saying it's all lefties, but some, even in the government, which makes it systemic. For example, the UK Grooming Scandal, or how in America, illegal immigrants in NYC get housing for free when Americans don't. (I would very much prefer it the other way around, Americans got housed for free, (Or no one at all, because the government is always corrupt, and they'll just use it an excuse to funnel taxpayer money to landlords)). Hell, there's lefties who think we shouldn't deport illegal immigrants! Even after they commit a crime other than illegally immigrating! For more examples, take a gander at the scholarships available, how many are minority specific? Plenty. How many are majority specific? None. How about homeless shelters? How many are women specific? Plenty (Which is a good thing). How many are male specific? Few. (Which is a bad thing) Hell, the entire saga of Earl Silverman and the first domestic violence shelter for men in Canada is heartbreaking.
I can go on, but it gets tiresome quickly. All of it is pretty racist.
For the second bit, the whole "not helping" bit.
What do you think happens when you send aid to 3rd world countries? Especially on going aid? When you send shirts, those shirts devastate the local textile industry. When you send food, it hurts the farms. Yeah, sure, you could subsidize those local industries, but that quickly spirals out of control. Which factories get funds? How much are the local warlords getting out of it? That sort of thing. If you aren't fully funding everything for an indefinite period of time, then you're hurting them.
That's not to say don't help in an earthquake or other natural disaster, but it's gotta be a light touch. Help them back on their feet and then let them go on their way.
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Have you considered that you’re wrong?
When I was a teenager, yeah. Came out more conservative.
Well, this has got to be one of the only things I've ever upvoted from you, but yea
Internet arguments are more about the audience than the tankie you're arguing against.
I've certainly taken that approach with the tankies these days, I used to debate them, now I don't really because its pointless. I reply to them every time, but it's arguments for the audience more than anything.
When I was petitioning for [email protected] to turn it into a satire comm, one kind of comment I saw come up was "if they don't have a comm where we can argue with them, how can we get them to see the light?" (And before anyone brings it up, yes there are other Lemmy spaces (and a whole instance! (HilariousChaos) that are for "serious" conservative comms like [email protected]) and I still think it's pointless to try because of what I covered with the opening post, but I was really hoping for at least a rare case of it happening.
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