this post was submitted on 02 Feb 2024
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[–] [email protected] 58 points 9 months ago (18 children)

Slavery already exists in the US in various forms, and in greater numbers than prior to the Civil War, but no I would not be surprised if the right wingers legalize slavery again, or if Gilead/Texas tries first.

Either way fuck the Confederate wannabes, we should smash them now so we don't have to do it yet again later, which is what Grant failed to do during the Reconstruction era.

Sherman was right!

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago (15 children)

What is your definition of slavery that would mean there is more slavery now than before the civil war?

[–] [email protected] 29 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (13 children)

Well there's absolutely a lot of real and actual slavery across the country, from domestic servants who are being held against their will, to sex slaves, and of course the numbers scale up with our population. So our population during the civil war was 31+ million, with close to 4 million of that being slaves, now we have 331+ million people, if you combine the instances of domestic and indentured servitude with sexual slavery, then add in those wrongfully in the prison system it scales to being much more than the sub 4 million in slavery during the civil war.

I know a lot of people would want to say "but the prison system is prisoners who committed crimes" but a lot of people are in prison because of failed justice, or on poverty based offenses, some of which compile with other petty offenses. Now also another caveat is that prison work isn't usually compulsory, it's normally voluntary, but one can argue that it's the prison that has the leverage over these people volunteering or not.

Overall these statistics aren't easy to calculate because modern day slavers want to hide and obfuscate their crimes, but it's there, it exists, and it exists in places you may not expect, like the next time you're sitting in a park in Manhattan consider the fact that one of the many domestic workers present may in fact be enslaved against their will, and this could be said in LA, Miami, Atlanta, anywhere in the US.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 9 months ago (1 children)

And even if someone is in the prison system for entirely correct reasons, forcing them to work is still slavery. I don't care if they're the most guilty awful person ever, if they need to be put in prison then put them in prison. That's the purpose of prison.

Trying to get economic benefit out of holding people in prison is not a slippery slope, it's a slippery cliff. The moment you try to justify it for anyone you're opening the door to a moral disaster.

[–] [email protected] -4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

But let's be objective with this, most of prison work is voluntary, and the desire to do something, anything, sometimes gets the best of us and due to that we'll do the volunteering, it's important to make that distinction, especially when I've been there and done that.

Now the obvious differences are prisons like Angola in Louisiana, which still has the same chaingang that they were depicted to have in movies decades behind us, there's no voluntary work there, those are prison work camps/concentration camps, and are tantamount to slavery, if not outright slavery, and are violent as hell, and these types of prisons can be found all across the American South, but especially along the Gulf Coast.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago (1 children)

"You can work and spend your entire pittance on ramen noodles, or you can go stir-crazy in your cell and eat stewed cardboard" is a voluntary choice only in the most strictly pedantic sense.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

That's being a bit Hyperbolic, and these aren't the types of prisons or jails where you're stuck in a cell all day, that's your misconception, the only people who are locked up like that are the ones that have proven themselves too dangerous to be around others, or at least that's how it's supposed to be when our prison system is working correctly, and the only prisons where that's consistently their prison existence is the SuperMax prisons, because again, those people are too dangerous to let roam without supervision.

Mostly it's just a chance to get out from behind the walls and the fences, sure they'd rather be free, but I'm sure we'd all rather they not do shut that gets them put in prison, and regardless of your feelings towards prisons people who commit crimes, real crimes, belong there, or some form of prison that emphasizes rehabilitation.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago

or at least that’s how it’s supposed to be when our prison system is working correctly

Opinions on whether it's "working correctly" is likely going to vary depending on whether you're running a factory that depends on prison labor. Right now I think those factory owners would agree that it's working correctly.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago (1 children)

And you are certain there is no reprisal against anyone that refuses?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Most guards could not give a shit less, they're there to do their jobs and go home, so if you're not going to volunteer some other person will, or they'll just take whomever did volunteer. Sure you might run into some dickhead guard that demands it but that guard is just a symptom of our broken system and is most likely operating in a manner that would get them in trouble if the right people are notified.

But as I said to another person who replied to me that then you have prisons like Angola, which are basically just concentration camps, they staff the place with brutal guards purposely to keep the place viciously violent, and every single one of the prisons like Angola should be shut down with the staff prosected.

So it really depends on the prison, but the majority are of the more mellow variety, although overpopulation makes the more mellow prisons drastically less mellow.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago

The Private Prisons have contracts to fulfill, your optimistic belief that folks all volunteer is laughable.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago

I have no idea who's downvoting your comments or why, you're providing a perspective most of us nerds don't have.

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