this post was submitted on 22 Dec 2023
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Similar to the recent question about artists where you can successfully separate them from their art. Are there any artists who did something so horrible, so despicable, that it has instantly invalidated all art that they have had any part in?

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[–] [email protected] 37 points 11 months ago (20 children)

Why would I try to do so in the first place?

Imagine someone telling you "you have to separate the product from the corporation. Yes, they lobby to permit slave labour and are directly funding the genocide in Palestine, but they make one fine chicken sandwich - and if you don't put down your silly objections to focus on that, you have failed as a human being".

Fuck that, fuck everything about that.

Art is political. Fiction doubly so. You cannot and should not try to rip art free from its cultural context, because that context is the perspective that gives it meaning in the first place.

And extra-splintery fuck the idea that the onus is on the audience to sweep everything under the carpet for horrible people.

We're in no danger of running out of art. We have an unlimited supply of artists just waiting for a break in the canopy to sprout up and grow into something new and exciting. If a handful of toxic assholes get canceled despite being popular, then so much the better.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 11 months ago (15 children)

I disagree. You can both admit that the company makes one damn fine chicken sandwich and still not buy it because they support slave labour. Them supporting slave labour doesn’t make it a bad chicken sandwich, just as them making a damn good chicken sandwich doesn’t stop them from supporting slave labour. It’s the method that’s important, not the reason itself.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 months ago (1 children)

That's the point though, that some people will use the 'but chicken sandwich is good' as a justification to overlook the other problems and still buy them. My ex and Hobby Lobby, for instance - she'd want to go there and shop for paints because they 'might have a sale', and I was just uh, no? Fuck Hobby Lobby.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Continue buying products direclty supports the company, that doesn't necessarily apply to art. Me simple enjoying a piece of art doesn't support the creator. Only when I buy or licence it.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago (1 children)

The popularity of art can both increase it's value and promote the creator, making their other works more valuable.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Potentially, sure. But that also doesn't apply if you're enjoying it in private.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Privately inside your own head or from a book you already owned that you then proceed to never discuss, sure. But views, downloads (even pirated), word of mouth, all help promote the work.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

What about when the artistis is dead and can no longer profit of his work by any means? Does that make the art "ok" again?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago

I think for a great many artists being remembered after their death is a significant part of making art. So if the artist like tried real real hard to remain in obscurity but was nevertheless discovered (a reverse-Van-Gogh if you will) then maybe.

Unrelated by I also think the artist, what they experienced, how and why they made it, are all implicitly part of the work.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

We work really hard to deprive ourselves of our own culture. From 90 year copyrights, to allowing all this geolocking multiple streaming services, to digital text, and to self-censorship.

Is anyone going to claim that they are a better person because they never read Harry Potter? No, I don't support her bigotry I just don't know what we gain out of having less culture.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Sure, but overlooking moral misgivings is the similarity. Just like I wouldn't tell someone 'hey, I love this sale at Hobby Lobby!' I wouldn't feel right about endorsing a star or director or artist or musician who was found to be a terrible person. The same applies to enjoying it in private - my knowledge about the creator would somewhat ruin my enjoyment of their work.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

I wouldn’t feel right about endorsing a star or director or artist or musician who was found to be a terrible person.

I don't think enjoying or even endorising a piece of art is equivalent to endorsing the people that produced it.

For example I will always enjoy Firefly and will keep recommending it to people, simple because it's an amazing show. What ever Joss Whedon has done doesn't change that. Hell, I wouldn't care if it was directed by Hitler and produced by Jeffery Dahmer.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

That seems to be the topic here... some people do feel uncomfortable about works having a connection to a terrible person, others don't. Personally I do think about the creator of artistic works when consuming them or as a fan, and I don't really want to be thinking "huh, I wonder what Hitler and Dahmer were thinking when they made that decision". On the other hand, some people love thinking about awful people like serial killers.

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