this post was submitted on 22 Dec 2023
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I actually prefer this type of hands-off approach. I find it offensive that people would refuse to let me see things because they deem it too "bad" for me to deal with. I find it insulting anyone would stop me reading how to make meth or read Mein Kampf. I'm 40yo and it's pretty fucking difficult to offend me and to think I'm going to be driven to commit crime just by reading is offensive.
I don't need protecting from speech/information. I'm perfectly capable and confident in my own views to deal with bullshit of all types.
If you're incapable of dealing with it - then don't fucking read it.
Fact is the more you clamp down on stuff like this the more you drive people into the shadows. 4chan and the darkweb become havens of 'victimhood' where they can spout their bullshit and create terrorists. When you prohibit information/speech you give it power.
In high school it was common for everyone to hunt for the Anarchists/Jolly Roger Cookbook. I imagine there's kids now who see it as a challenge to get hold of it and terrorist manuals - not because they want to blow shit up, but because it's taboo!
Same with drugs - don't pick and eat that mushroom. Don't burn that plant. Anyone with 0.1% of curiosity will ask "why?" and do it because they want to know why it's prohibited.
Porn is another example. The more you lock it down the more people will thirst for it.
Open it all up to the bright light of day. Show it up for all it's naked stupidity.
That's not really how this works. Do you also think advertising and marketing don't work?
In what way is advertising and marketing the same as Mein Kampf?
In a lot of languages advertising and propaganda are literally the same word. The only difference is whether the goal is commercial or political.
I'm still not sure how that relates to the point I was making.
I don't want anyone to censor what I'm allowed to see.
If you're asking if that's how I feel about advertising then yes - of course. Like I said I want to be wholly responsible for what I see or don't see. I don't want people a government or corporation parenting my viewing.
The corporation already makes choices about your viewing. Unless it's a completely unmoderated wiki, they make choices about what is allowed. There are presumably lines that substack (or anyone) are unwilling to cross. We can probably assume that they would not be okay with "livestream of grinding up babies and puppies and snorting them".
If such a line exists, then I am saying nazi shit should be on the far side of the line.
If such a line does NOT exist, then I guess we'd have to have that discussion about why some things are unacceptable.
If the line is "only what is literally illegal" then that just punts editorial responsibility into a slower, less responsive system. It's a cowardly shirking of responsibility.
As to how it relates:
That's false. That's not how you or anyone works. You are just as vulnerable to advertising as anyone else. And even if you were the platonic ideal of Strong Rational Man, many other people aren't.
If we were talking about government censorship, which we were not, then that's a slightly different conversation. The government has more power and is fundamentally different than a private blog platform or whatever.
Censorship isn't the right word here, I would say. Censorship would make sense if this were a government that was being spoken about but it's not.
I'll take it from the perspective of myself, I run a Lemmy instance that is open for people to register for (after a brief application question and confirming your email address). If someone registered, and wanted to post Nazi-adjacent content I would remove it and ban them right away.
I would not be "censoring" your ability to see it. I would be saying "I do not want to host this content on the hardware that I am paying for and maintain". Sure, you could argue that the side effect is that you're not able to see it, but my intent isn't "censorship". If you want to see red and pink diamonds (just a completely abstract example), but I did not want to host it, then as the person who's paying for the hardware then my want will always come first. That isn't to say that others aren't free (including yourself) to host said red and pink diamonds.
Censorship as a term makes sense for the government, because they have the power to enforce that everyone under their ruling must not host red and pink diamonds. I alone do not. Now, maybe almost every single Lemmy instance also doesn't want to host red and pink diamonds - that would still not be censorship, that would just be most instance admins happen to align the same and are executing the same rules for their own sites.
Of course, replace myself with a private business owner, and Lemmy instances with something like a News subscription website, the meaning should still be the same. Hopefully my stance makes sense, I'm not writing this with the intent of "You're wrong and I'm right" in the direct sense, but as a "I disagree, and here's why".
I did see your conversation with the other person here, and I agree that government censorship is bad (such as the weird concept of having to upload your ID to view porn), but I just don't view this in the same way I suppose.
Obviously, Substack is within their rights to allow red and pink diamonds if they want, but if they didn't then that would not be censorship (in my eyes, at least).
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